Meeting: Public (2014-02-02)

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Steven_Zhang	 Well
Steven_Zhang	 Hi Pru
Pru	 Hi Steve - and all
u99of9	 Who's here?
Steven_Zhang	 Bit many
u99of9	 @jayvdb? @Barras? @p858snake|l @peter-} @snail?
u99of9	 I don't recognize all the nicks - are you the only one from the Committee Steven?
Steven_Zhang	 Just a reminder these meetings are logged
Steven_Zhang	 Pru
Steven_Zhang	 Meeting is open
* peter	-} is just an ordinary member.
u99of9	 hi peter, hi pru
Pru	 Hi u99of9 - is this how you like to be called?
u99of9	 99of9 / Toby
Steven_Zhang	 There are u
Pru	 Cheers Toby:)
u99of9	 the u is because IRC doesn't allow digits at the start of a name
Steven_Zhang	 There aren't any items on the agenda iirc
Steven_Zhang	 open format
Steven_Zhang	 I am driving
Steven_Zhang	 :)
u99of9	 what are the big things the committee is thinking through at the moment?
u99of9	 driving what?  a car or the agenda?
Pru	 Item for the agenda Steve: What do members value as priority for the Annual Plan?
Steven_Zhang	 aye
Steven_Zhang	 a car
Steven_Zhang	 Yea Pru
Steven_Zhang	 That's one
Pru	 As someone new to the committee, it would be helpful to know what others see as valuable use of time and resources
Steven_Zhang	 and what members want from wmau
Steven_Zhang	 How about you toby?
u99of9	 Less than 10% of the talk should be about the rules of the organization.
u99of9	 Getting minutes online should be as efficient as possible
u99of9	 Perhaps copying around a summary of each meeting to the main mailing list (e.g. one line for each resolution passed)
Steven_Zhang	 That's fine for public meetings
u99of9	 I like programs like the regional/city workshops
Steven_Zhang	 Committee meetings normally get accepted at the following meeting and then can be published 
u99of9	 and direct glam partnerships (where we put in mostly manpower, not $$$)
Steven_Zhang	 (not driving anymore)
gnangarra	 hi
Steven_Zhang	 Pru can you keep a log of this meeting? I'm mobile
Steven_Zhang	 Hi Gideon
Pru	 I can log from when I came in - just missed first 10 minutes
Steven_Zhang	 from when I announced the meeting would be logged is fine :)
u99of9	 I think we should be applying for WMF funds.  It sounds like our main deficiency is keeping records of what we are doing and how well it goes...
Steven_Zhang	 I think our first step is to decide what we want to do
gnangarra	 measurablse are an issue
Steven_Zhang	 For the year 
Steven_Zhang	 Then decide on core and non core stuff
u99of9	 ... so I think the committee should have a centralized reporting spreadsheet, and event organizers or grant recipients should only get the funds if they fill in the fields on the spreadsheet
Steven_Zhang	 What we really want to do and what we would like to do
Steven_Zhang	 wmf does the same
u99of9	 so why don't we?
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gnangarra	 there was one of those around but they get too complex
gnangarra	 trying to gather every possible piece of info from every scenario
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u99of9	 yes, I copied around one - thanks for filling in some of your events gnangarra
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Steven_Zhang	 dropped sorry
gnangarra	 trouble was fitting it in the shoe holes provided
Pru	 As a geographically dispersed organisation we are so reliant on individuals organising and documenting events. A spreadsheet/calendar or online form even of the basic details would be a good start
u99of9	 Steven_Zhang - you said wmf does the same... you mean asks for spreadsheet reporting?  then why don't we?
u99of9	 gnangarra - I think spreadsheets are more powerful (mostly for aggregation purposes) than written reports.
Steven_Zhang	 nah I mean separate core and non core
u99of9	 Yes Pru, it can be simpler if gnangarra thinks the earlier version was too complex
u99of9	 but I think the committee should set one up, otherwise whatever we do, it will never be recognized
Pru	 If we at least had a record of the event date, title, organiser a committee member could contact them to get the required information for our reporting purposes. We need people to organised/do things, not be put off by onerous reporting 
gnangarra	 50 fields with only 2 or 3 relevant just makes it too time consuming and complex for people to fill it
gnangarra	 yes basic details should be recorded
u99of9	 agreed gnangarra, simple is good... for example, for image collection events, I don't think there's any point making the event organizer use tools to find out what became FP/QI/VI
u99of9	 ... just supply a category that all the pictures went into
gnangarra	 trouble is after 9 months and 12 dozen or so trips to Toodyay its only just showing measurable numbers
Pru	 Yikes! Agreed. What would be useful info? Purpose, costs, attendees, benefits, things we learned/would do differently next time
u99of9	 I think the committee should look at what the WMF will ask of them, and design as simple as possible a reporting tool that meets those needs.
gnangarra	 FYI the measurable https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Buildings_in_Toodyay form toodyay
Pru	 Yes - and links to articles/photos uploaded. They can be looked at later by someone compiling a proposal/funding submission
u99of9	 Pru, for images a category is better than links.
u99of9	 because there could well be thousands
u99of9	 nice Gnangarra
Steven_Zhang	 :)
gnangarra	 bang for buck, though it hasnt cost WMAU anything wouldnt be all that great if I asked for expenses
gnangarra	 as 99of9 suggest cats work better to collate results https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedia_Takes_Waroona
u99of9	 maybe it's worth asking some fraction of expenses, or at least estimating the true cost, just to show reporting bodies that real effort is going in
u99of9	 btw the SLNSW is still doing fantastic work
Pru	 Chicken and egg here: why do we worry so much about asking for external funding when we don't seem to need it to do the activities we are doing?
u99of9	 just because gnangarra isn't asking for it doesn't mean we don't need it
gnangarra	 Pru we do need, the problem lies in the request processes
u99of9	 (or we couldn't do more if we had it)
gnangarra	 who is going to fund 12 trips at around 150 each if they cant have something to measure
Pru	 OK: what would we deliver if we had $20,000 grant?
u99of9	 the egg is clear to me ... lay out the reporting facility that you need, so that we can report on the excellent stuff that's already done/ongoing
u99of9	 more diverse pictures and articles about australia
Steven_Zhang	 Other chapters do quarterly reports 
Steven_Zhang	 This is something I think we should do too.
u99of9	 don't overbite... aim for annual
u99of9	 (first)
Steven_Zhang	 annual is the minimum requirement
gnangarra	 agree we need to record results, woul dthink we need half yearly, dec..jun just before funding rounds
Steven_Zhang	 problem is if we wait that long
u99of9	 hell, one report would be good
u99of9	 no, don't wait
Steven_Zhang	 It's hard to remember it all
u99of9	 start recording now
u99of9	 and ask us members to backdate once you know what details you want
Steven_Zhang	 membership engagement seems to be an issue
u99of9	 I can easily fill in details for about 6 events, because all were recorded on wiki
u99of9	 we can't engage if you don't tell us what you want
u99of9	 (for reporting)
Steven_Zhang	 more in general
u99of9	 but yes, I agree that other engagement is lacking
gnangarra	 99 you up for building a simple recording template on WMAU wiki
u99of9	 I'm a fan of meetups - a function that WMAU clearly has a place in because it's not an in-universe event
Steven_Zhang	 aye
Steven_Zhang	 I like meetups
u99of9	 I think the committee should gnangarra - because I haven't studied what the WMF want
Pru	 Where is the best place to host that results/report. Do we set it up on the Reports page? http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/Reports
u99of9	 so @peter-} and anyone else in Sydney... there's a meetup tomorrow https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Meetup/Sydney#The_Paragon_Hotel_-_Circular_Quay.2C_Feb_3rd.2C_from_5.30pm_til_late
u99of9	 also gnangarra, I'm not sure that wiki markup is the best format for a reporting tool ... isn't spreadsheet better?
gnangarra	 yeah I think that would be best
gnangarra	 on wiki is the best starting place
gnangarra	 everyone knows how to fill in a template
Steven_Zhang	 We can use a Google spreadsheet once we are moved over
Pru	 Link to embedded Google doc would be great
gnangarra	 Keep it simple
u99of9	 the last report on http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/Reports is from May ... I suggest an email reminder to anyone who's received a grant from then
u99of9	 perhaps add a standing agenda item to follow up how many reports are currently outstanding
u99of9	 spreadsheets can be simple
Pru	 We also want to collect activity from those who haven't received grants - just got on and did something. They have no obligation but helps our case
u99of9	 agreed Pru
gnangarra	 yup
u99of9	 add a standing agenda item to name unfunded people to send reporting requests to
Pru	 Suggested ation: Committee to draft simple template for reporting - after checking WMF requirements - and post link on WMAU Reports page
u99of9	 great
Steven_Zhang	 Great
u99of9	 Suggested action: Committee to set up procedures to keep track of and remind outstanding reports.
u99of9	 I haven't been following closely - I take it we withdrew from the ARC grant?
gnangarra	 in the process of withdrawing
Steven_Zhang	 We discussed this in our committee meeting last week
u99of9	 if so, I assume that letters of apology to our partners will be sent?
Steven_Zhang	 but yes we are in that process. 
Steven_Zhang	 It won't be just that
u99of9	 go on?
Pru	 Have we lost Steve? There have been meetings and ongoing agonising over this.
Steven_Zhang	 I'm here 
Steven_Zhang	 Sorry
Steven_Zhang	 Well we won't just send them a letter saying "sorry but no"
Pru	 Committee was keen to do more than just apologise - but find ways to support that didn't involve that kind of money
Steven_Zhang	 We will be offering our support otherwise 
Steven_Zhang	 than financial
Steven_Zhang	 My phone is almost outta juice btw
gnangarra	 lagging again
Pru	 Are there any other agenda items from members?
u99of9	 good to offer support, but an apology is also important
Pru	 Did we finish engagement question?
Steven_Zhang	 Yeah apologies will be given
gnangarra	 what was the question
u99of9	 the quickest way to get engagement is to start an argument about the rules ... don't do that!
gnangarra	 ok rule 1 :)
u99of9	 the best way to get engagement is to provide something that the editing community want
gnangarra	 what do they want
u99of9	 I think the photographic equipment program meets this objective
u99of9	 I think meetups are in the WMAU remit
u99of9	 I think submitting official opinions to govt requests for comment are in the WMAU court
Pru	 At least three types of members we want to engage: editors, potential editors and those not interested in/able to edit but wish to support the movement in other ways
u99of9	 and the thing i will vote you out for if you don't achieve it is making a proper attempt to establish a real source of funding ... (the WMF is the obvious)
Pru	 eg in last group include organisations happy to provide content/images if someone else edits it, educators etc
u99of9	 agreed Pru, but obviously editors are the core at the moment, and I would expect that will continue
Pru	 Good. So we need to find out what we can pay editors to do that they can't do at the moment.
u99of9	 gnangarra, in your wikitown, are you putting QR codes up?
gnangarra	 which town
u99of9	 :) any
gnangarra	 yes all will have codes
gnangarra	 Freo has about 70 out there
u99of9	 what are they made of?  did WMAU supply?
gnangarra	 they printed on aluminium with resin coating, funded by a grant from Fremantle BiD project
Guest11849	 Guys I'm about to drop out but will be back soon
Guest11849	 (Steve here)
u99of9	 that kind of thing would be good .... a nice professional one for every good article associated with an Australian place
gnangarra	 they cost about $40 each to make
gnangarra	 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fremantle_Harbour_QRpedia_plate.JPG
u99of9	 ok, the kind of money a wikipedian might not spend out of their own pocket, but one that might drive at least $40 of interest to WMAU /  Wikipedia
gnangarra	 they do drive hits to pages
gnangarra	 the stats from QR reads arent work atm to show
Pru	 How are they funded now Gideon?
gnangarra	 Freo is looking for funding, BiD was a once off
gnangarra	 grant
gnangarra	 Toodyay is being funded by the Shire
gnangarra	 shold say will be
gnangarra	 Waroona isnt that far advanced yet
u99of9	 ok, so councils may be keen to promote like that (esp since they get their name on it), but I think WMAU should backstop every Australian article that achieves a certain level
Pru	 Presumably the shire/city would want to control the fixing of aluminium to their buildings
gnangarra	 in Freo we did it
gnangarra	 but yeah the Shire will do it in Toodyay
u99of9	 e.g. Whiteghost.Ink just got [[St James' Chuch, Sydney]] to FA .... wouldn't she be inspired to do more if a nice WMAU QR-plate arrived in the mail
gnangarra	 fix them on isnt hard
Pru	 But we could certainly do a project that contacted councils/organisations to offer to fund particular landmarks
gnangarra	 getting permissions would be an issue
u99of9	 Pru the organization/council would obviously need to agree, but the editor could be responsible for obtaining that permission 
u99of9	 (before ordering the plate)
gnangarra	 its hard to do single plates, that would drive the cost up a lot
u99of9	 [BTW I'm suggesting "good article" level just to control the numbers, but the wikitown concept obviously has validity in numbers]
Pru	 Could be quite a high publicity project with some consistent 'marketing' documentation to get Councils on board. They could apply, or the editor could apply in conjunction 
gnangarra	 the $40 was for 100 at a time
u99of9	 (but each of the 100 was different?)
gnangarra	 yes each was different
Pru	 We could have a submission form online, have an agreement/semi-sponsorship deal with the company who makes them so they get recognition
Pru	 Then place an order every month/quarter when we reach 100
u99of9	 So WMAU could wait until we had batches of 50 good articles ready to send out
gnangarra	 yes that would work
gnangarra	 The artwork isnt to hard to create
Pru	 What happens if an organisation wants to be involved but we can't find an editor to get the article up to scratch?
gnangarra	 they could be encouraged
u99of9	 They can pay the $40
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u99of9	 even if the article isn't at GA level
Pru	 Can we pay a 'project office'
Pru	 project officer who is responsible for finding editors?
SteveMobile	 sounds good
u99of9	 lol whoops Steven
SteveMobile	 Sorry about all the disconnecting had to go to ikea :)
u99of9	 Steven_54 you just leaked your password
u99of9	 might want to change that
u99of9	 I'd advise against paying for editors to write an organizational page
u99of9	 I'd say they can still participate in the QR scheme if there's a pre-existing article and they are happy to stump up $50
u99of9	 (the organization can I mean)
Pru	 Agreed, but an organiser to help coordinate the project and ensure the reporting happens?
u99of9	 just as the councils did at gnangarra's prompting
SteveMobile	 Did I?
SteveMobile	 Bigger. 
SteveMobile	 bugger rather
gnangarra	 do we need an organisors yet
u99of9	 \msg
gnangarra	 why not just set aside funds say 5K
u99of9	 I think you put an accidental space in front of /msg
SteveMobile	 to pay people to organise projects?
gnangarra	 and say will will be creating 100 QR codes
u99of9	 that will inspire editors to get Australian content up to the required level
gnangarra	 plaques ask the members to id the articles they thing will be suitbale
Pru	 Gideon, is there a photo of the QR codes online?
u99of9	 ... unfortunately I can't stick a plaque on the cicada's I write about :)
gnangarra	 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fremantle_Harbour_QRpedia_plate.JPG
gnangarra	 but you could have it at a botanic garden
u99of9	 I'd say it's better not to give me one unless the article is specifically associated with a place
gnangarra	 what about putting one near where the type species was collected
gnangarra	 1st collected
u99of9	 So... some biographies might qualify because there might be a significant house/grave site/etc that allows permission
u99of9	 *gives permission to attach a plaque
Pru	 Going back to the comment about the stats from QR codes... is there a problem with this. We need metrics
u99of9	 we can track hits on those articles
gnangarra	 yeah they are working on it the issue is privacy in collecting mobil data
u99of9	 before/after hits might be convincing on their own
u99of9	 and it's fair to include the bump that a better article always gets ... because WMAU had a role in inspiring it to get better
Pru	 OK. Well it would at least meet the goal of increased quality of articles, as well as engagement with communities, and successfully running a project
gnangarra	 dyk hits work well
gnangarra	 and it would bring in more interest
gnangarra	 in wikitowns
Pru	 Is there a way to recognise the editor/s who contribute?
u99of9	 right, I forgot DYK - I'd be happy to lower the standard to DYK if WMAU thought they had sufficient funds... but that could get expensive
u99of9	 Pru, good idea
u99of9	 I think the design of the plaque is actually quite important....
gnangarra	 the plaque I use has room current used by logos at the mottom
gnangarra	 that was meant to currently used at bottom
SteveMobile	 Not sure about lowering to dyk
gnangarra	 DYK can be for large expansion as well
u99of9	 fields like: article name / article writers / plaque sponsor (usually WMAU) / WMAU anyway / simple description of the item / connection to this location
SteveMobile	 We could do DYK for 5x
Pru	 Gideon: anything you would do differently with the plaque design? And should we go to tender, or continue with your supplier?
gnangarra	 my supplier is great, they can ship direct anywhere after production
u99of9	 btw I think the WMF are currently in favour of editing contests ... and this sort of fits the bill, except there's a prize for everyone :)
gnangarra	 itd be something other chapters could duplicate as well
SteveMobile	 prize for everyone?
u99of9	 5x expansion DYK could be gamed... set up a v short article first ... then expand at low quality
gnangarra	 with WWI as a focus there would be many sites we could code
Pru	 I like it because encourages organisations who want a plaque to work out how to get the article sorted
SteveMobile	 You mean apart from a sense of achievement 
u99of9	 (everyone who writes a GA about a place-associated Australian topic gets their achievement stuck to a wall)
SteveMobile	 Ah yes
gnangarra	 that would drive people to an already backlogged project though
gnangarra	 so we'd have to support that process as well
u99of9	 GA?  don't worry, that's what we want on wiki... more GA candidates
u99of9	 yes, support reviewing if we can
u99of9	 that can be a requirement if you like ... review one as well
Pru	 We could look at funding for specific subprojects, eg funding to working with schools/local history groups/churches...
gnangarra	 not yet lets keep to members to encourage them first before going outside
Pru	 to incorporate the recruiting objective
u99of9	 Pru if you go down that road, I think you just have to be a bit careful about PublicRelations / Advertisors
u99of9	 *Advertisers
gnangarra	 these groups that are interested would come from a permission to post the plaque as the next stage
Pru	 possibly
SteveMobile	 We shouldn't discourage GAs cos it will create a backlog
u99of9	 Agreed SteveMobile, but gnangarra is right that GA submitters should also be involved in reviewing
gnangarra	 GA is a good level to ask as a minimum
u99of9	 btw as your first batch, to get serious kick-off momentum, I'd suggest opening it to existing Australian place-related GAs
SteveMobile	 sure
gnangarra	 cureently there 536 GA australian articles and another 364 that are a class or fa
u99of9	 it won't encourage those to be edited so much, but it would get the stats moving quickly
u99of9	 ok, so 1000 x $40 is too much for a trial program
SteveMobile	 aye
u99of9	 so at first keep a reasonably strict place-related requirement
gnangarra	 actually according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Australian_places they have only one GA or better article
u99of9	 I'd guess that will divide it by 5ish
u99of9	 haha, well I know there are plenty others that are about buildings or roads etc
u99of9	 and I think quite a few biographies would qualify
u99of9	 perhaps one of us can look through the list of 1000 and see how many have a clear place?
gnangarra	 I think we should using the term building over place
u99of9	 sounds ok, though sculpture etc clearly qualifies
SteveMobile	 Sorry I haven't been overly engaged today...had to run to the shops at the worst time. .
u99of9	 so "building, broadly construed"
jayvdb	 hi sorry I am late
gnangarra	 yeah
u99of9	 but actually, I think some natural places should qualify too
gnangarra	 memorials, statues etc
gnangarra	 some place should like Bare Island
u99of9	 bondi beach /  mount tambourine
u99of9	 etc
gnangarra	 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bare_Island_%28New_South_Wales%29
gnangarra	 must upload my pano of that 
Pru	 A proposal is needed to get this to the committee for consideration - how much of this detail?
u99of9	 hi jayvdb
SteveMobile	 Hi John
u99of9	 it's good to brainstorm detail, single proposal-writers often get blinkered
gnangarra	 I'll start a proposal page on WMAU
SteveMobile	 draft something and send to the list?
u99of9	 thanks gnangarra, I'm happy to copyedit
u99of9	 last time I pitched this to jayvdb he told me to write a proposal, but I still haven't gotten around to it
Pru	 Do we put a timeline or limit on the project? For review at end of 2014?
u99of9	 sure Pru, and you probably want a $$$ limit
gnangarra	 I think shorter
jayvdb	 u99of9: ;-)
SteveMobile	 pilots are good
gnangarra	 was proposing by April, would give enough time
SteveMobile	 Let's work on the details
SteveMobile	 write the basic concept into our plan for this year
SteveMobile	 As its something we do have to finish :)
Pru	 Do we have any existing relationships with councils or organisations? Or do we start with posting a list of candidate articles and then decide who to contact
gnangarra	 we contact the site once the article is at GA
SteveMobile	 tap Into existing relationships ,
SteveMobile	 We have some with state libraries 
gnangarra	 just need a formatted letter to send out for permission
gnangarra	 http://www.wikimedia.org.au//wiki/Proposal:QR_codes_GA_articles bare bones atm
Pru	 If we need to order 100 - let's tie the pilot project funds to that, ie get our first 100 up 
u99of9	 I don't think you should limit to April, because an important part of it is encouraging new GAs
Pru	 Permission letter with photo and dimensions of the plaque and example from Freo. Could we get a referee statement or endorsement from the Mayor there?
gnangarra	 yeah I can get that
gnangarra	 would print a sample(carboard) plaque to include with the letter
Pru	 They get the kudos of the first Australian project
u99of9	 contact the editors before the organization IMO ... the editors may have insider contacts
gnangarra	 need to conact the location owner for permissions
u99of9	 agreed gnangarra, but I think the editor will often be the best person to do that
gnangarra	 I think it needs the official stamp of an organisation rather than an individual
u99of9	 e.g. I bet whiteghost.ink can wheedle permission from St James faster than a form letter can
gnangarra	 maybe we do either methods
u99of9	 ok, so maybe send the official stamp letter to the editor, and get them to present it to their contact
gnangarra	 yeah that would help
jayvdb	 The St James one is a bit problematic due to it containing the logo without WMF permission
Pru	 Presume there are no issues with the plaque on heritage-listed buildings?
gnangarra	 there are issues
gnangarra	 mostly from material types
gnangarra	 and sizes
SteveMobile	 We can use our logo iirc
jayvdb	 The new trademark agreement will fix that
gnangarra	 we would want to use our logo
SteveMobile	 I'd have to check the chapters agreement tho
SteveMobile	 We've used it on other letters before
Pru	 We should investigate those issues so we have a solution when it is raised
jayvdb	 Using it for official business is different
gnangarra	 these would be an official project of WMAU
SteveMobile	 Worth asking 
u99of9	 jayvdb you mean the existing qr code ... we're not talking about that, that was done ad hoc
jayvdb	 When the new trademark agreement is approved by the WMF board, these issues disappear, or are more clearly navigatable
u99of9	 I agree it would be good to get the trademarks situation clarified
jayvdb	 u99of9: the existing QR at St James is very problematic.  For new ones, I think it is worth waiting until the new trademark policy is approved
jayvdb	 design with it in mind
u99of9	 Pru I don't think it would usually be attached directly to a heritage building
jayvdb	 the landscape is much clearer . https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Trademark_policy
gnangarra	 it is in Freo 99
u99of9	 but heritage buildings always have information boards/signage etc, it would usually fit in somewhere there
SteveMobile	 Great
gnangarra	 signange normally doesnt have that much space
u99of9	 when do you expect that to be jayvdb?
jayvdb	 soon - it was supposed to be discussed by the WMF board at their meeting yesterday
SteveMobile	 Worth checking with LCA?
u99of9	 do you expect the policy to permit the typefaced "Wikipedia" on such a plaque?
SteveMobile	 AH
jayvdb	 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Agenda_January_31st-February_1st_2014_Board_Meeting
gnangarra	 https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Freopedia_Customs_House_plaque.jpg
jayvdb	 sort of.  it is covered here: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Trademark_policy#policy-glam
gnangarra	 Freo used WikipediA with permission from WMF
jayvdb	 WMAU would need a 'Quick License'
jayvdb	 gnangarra: that was the last one they approved, and are unlikely to approve any more in that adhoc manner
gnangarra	 yeah I know
gnangarra	 was just clarifying because the images of the plaques so it being used
jayvdb	 the new trademark policy is the framework for the future, so any WMAU concepts should be built with it in mind
u99of9	 is that ceramic gnangarra?  fwiw I like that a little better than the aluminium
gnangarra	 that is the Aluminium with a resin coating
gnangarra	 UV protected coating
u99of9	 extra cost?
gnangarra	 no thats included
gnangarra	 only other cost is instalation
Pru	 We are over the 2 hours - has been very constructive project development meeting. Are we able to take the rest offline?
gnangarra	 I'm good for a while longer if necessary
jayvdb	 When will the last board meeting minutes be released?
jayvdb	 And how did the Perth meetup yesterday go?
u99of9	 so,  skimming that policy-glam page jayvdb, does that mean the building it's stuck to must be a cultural institution?
u99of9	 I need to go soon
jayvdb	 u99of9: no - it is the section for 'wiki-town' like permissions too
SteveMobile	 John you mean the one from last week?
jayvdb	 SteveMobile: yes
jayvdb	 minutes from the AGM too .. ;-)
SteveMobile	 well, as you know is standard the minutes are drafted and then tabled at the next committee meeting 
SteveMobile	 Once accepted they can be published 
jayvdb	 that was not the standard previously
jayvdb	 they were published as draft if they contained anything important
u99of9	 at church AGMs we authorize the first executive meeting to approve the AGM minutes
jayvdb	 to be discussed at the public meeting
jayvdb	 otherwise you have a six week turnaround on public feedback
SteveMobile	 We used to publish unapproved minutes?
jayvdb	 yes we did
u99of9	 we can't have a one year turnaround for AGM minutes
SteveMobile	 hm. Odd. 
SteveMobile	 No I agree 
jayvdb	 the WMF board publishes notes as well
u99of9	 it's fine to publish if you clearly mark it as a draft
jayvdb	 within a few days of their meetings
SteveMobile	 The last agm minutes took until Feb or march?
SteveMobile	 I've got a draft of the latest committee meeting minutes. agm minutes I have to check with Andrew.
jayvdb	 Possibly.  It should be done asap.
u99of9	 anyway, the point is, please be as quick as you can, delay is a surefire way of disengaging the members
jayvdb	 yup - ideally before the public meeting which follows the ctte meeting
SteveMobile	 sure :) will ensure we work on that 
jayvdb	 that keeps the feedback happening
jayvdb	 it isnt always possible
jayvdb	 volunteers and all
jayvdb	 but it should be the goal at least
SteveMobile	 agreed
SteveMobile	 Ok I gotta run
jayvdb	 cya
SteveMobile	 Pru do you have a lot
SteveMobile	 Log
u99of9	 I'm out too.  Thanks all.
SteveMobile	 cheerio
gnangarra	 I'm off
gnangarra	 caio
Pru	 Hope so - I tested earlier. Will email to you Steve. Cheers everyone
u99of9	 probably not formatted well, but it's all there
</nowiki></pre>
End of #wikimedia-au buffer    Sun Feb 02 18:18:25 2014